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Hyper-V Default switch IP address range change. Ver 1809 Build 17763.1

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I figured out how to create a new NAT internal switch with a static IP. It can be done via Powershell: Using a NAT Virtual Switch with Hyper-V

 

These are the commands I used to re-create the 192.168.5.X NAT network like I had in VMware Workstation:

 

New-VMSwitch -SwitchName “NATSwitch” -SwitchType Internal

New-NetIPAddress -IPAddress 192.168.5.1 -PrefixLength 24 -InterfaceAlias “vEthernet (NATSwitch)”

New-NetNAT -Name “NATNetwork” -InternalIPInterfaceAddressPrefix 192.168.5.0/24

 

I knew there must be a way since my scenario is very common in software development. There's just no way to do it in the Hyper-V Switch Manager GUI.

 

I have no use for the Default Switch now, but it doesn't appear to be remove-able...at least not without some registry hacking.

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@mlmathews 

In that same article:

"the end result is that (to begin with) that virtual machines on the internal virtual switch can talk to the host, but they cannot talk to the network that the host is connected to."

That's totally useless for me.

I want my Virtual machine to be able to talk to the host network and be accessible from the Internet or in case of a server, it host websites on ISS, provide VPN server connections to outside clients over the Internet.

my host is already behind a phyiscal router, putting my VMs on yet another NAT with different subnets makes things worse and impossible.

with External Virtual Swtich in Hyper-V, i can give an IP address (v6 or v4) to my VM and then put that VM's IP address in my physical router's DMZ so it can be accessible from the Internet.

that's how servers operate. Hyper-V does a great job by letting VMs directly be involved with the real network.

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@HotCakeX The VM can connect to the network using an internal switch if it's set up with a virtual NAT firewall. My local server VM can connect to Microsoft Update (and the rest of the local network + internet). However, only the host (my laptop) can initiate connections to the VM...which is perfect for a development testing scenario. There are other servers (vSphere VMs) that the code is pushed to when it's time to make it available to other people for testing and production.

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Exactly what i said. the External Virtual Network switch is used for Real-Life scenarios. i wasn't talking about test purposes.
test purposes can have whatever strange settings they want.
Servers such ca CA, VPN, IIS, VDI etc are needed to connect to the outside world in order to do their job and serve. the Internet network would be already behind a NAT which belongs to the physical router.
there is no point in putting it behind yet another NAT.
the external IP address is 1 and when users from Internet want to connect to the Virtual Servers, they have limited possibilities, the best one would be to use VPN and then access the local network of the Servers/Clients but that also does Not need double NATs.
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@HotCakeX I'm not intending to argue with you and what I'm about to say is not directly related to the original topic of this thread, but you might be surprised at what's being done in "real-life" networking scenarios these days. The reason I switched from VMware to Hyper-V on my dev machine is because I need to work with Window Containers and Docker Desktop, which requires Hyper-V. Currently Hyper-V and VMware cannot coexist, but that is about to change. In the container world, VM's are just hosts for containers and usually many containers. For example IIS would not run directly on a server VM, but in a container. In larger scale systems like I work with, everything is redundant and disposable. For example, the web application I work on has many instances in production all sitting behind a reverse proxy (which itself is in a container). If one instance dies for some reason, no big deal, another is spun up to replace it. The containers are all behind a Hyper-V internal switch with NAT. Anyway, it you want to learn more about containers in the Windows world, here's a good place to start: About Windows containers

 

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Yeah as you said it's off topic so i have no interest in discussing containers.
but as i said, using double NATs won't let servers be accessible from the Internet. specially if it's a nested virtualization that I use mostly.
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You are my hero! I have been fighting this since I setup hyper v on windows 10 a couple of days ago. I was dropping packets left and right once I started my virtual machine. Thank you!!
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@mlmathews It sounds as though our respective use-cases may be similar.

 

(Edit to add: I had missed your most recent reply, as I failed to notice page 2; I will look into the PowerShell-based solution! Thank you!)

 

I'm a web developer who works primarily with VMs running GNU/Linux. I work in a Windows-driven, corporate ecosystem, though, so my primary development machine runs Windows 10 with Hyper-V.

 

I have many different VMs that I spin-up on a regular basis, oftentimes freshly-provisioned (that is, built dynamically and booted for the first time on each use). The provisioning process is 100% automated, which I mention only to make clear that there is no room for "manual tweaking" nor GUI configuration in my workflow; any networking configuration has to be automated during provisioning.

 

Further, I have many VM configurations in which one VM needs to communicate with one or more other VMs on the same subnet, which requires that each source VM knows any potential destination VM's IP address (a hostname could work, too, if hostname resolution was configured correctly, which I haven't yet attempted with Hyper-V).

 

More importantly, I need this subnet to be completely isolated from my physical NIC so that there is zero possibility of another machine on my LAN communicating with any of the VMs running in Hyper-V.

 

But I also need for the VMs to be able to connect to the Internet.

 

So, here's where I'm stuck:

 

1.) Default Switch: IP address assigned to VMs changes at random on host system reboot, so without hostname resolution across multiple VMs on VLAN, this configuration is untenable.

2.) External Network: This makes my VMs visible on our corporate LAN, which is a no-go.

3.) Internal Network: My VMs cannot obtain IPv4 addresses for some reason; only IPv6. No idea why this is.

4.) Private Network: Doesn't allow VMs access to internet, so not viable.

 

@HotCakeXDo you have a clever solution that will meet my requirements?

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Hi,
This thread is really old and in a few days Windows 10 1909 is being released for the public use.
currently Windows 10 1903 is globally available for both home and businesses. lot of things have improved ever since.

so which Windows 10 build are you using?
I personally use Windows 10 insider fast ring build 18990 (2001).

okay so for you special situation, I would use 2 physical NICs, which is very normal for configurations like yours.
1 physical NIC would provide connection for the Host only (Internet connection + communication with other LAN devices on your real network) and the other physical NIC would be tied to all of your VMs as an (External) virtual network adapter.

this way your VMs would be isolated from the host and other devices on your LAN, as they all have access to the physical NIC 2 only (through an external virtual network adapter).


Another possibility would be to set up 2 virtual network adapters. 1 private (for inter-VM communications) and the other to give VMs Internet access which is again the 2nd physical NIC as an external network adapter).
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@HotCakeX 

 

Is the default switch's crazy behavior of re-creating its vEthernet adapter on every reboot fixed in 1909 (or later)? 

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@mlmathews 

 

Nope,

if you need to use the default switch you can create your own persistent route from the powershell.

 

what is actually crazy is that when someone decides to setup servers and then use the default switch for that server, after that complain why the default switch gets a new IP address after each reboot!!!

 

Microsoft never designed the default switch for long term usage or advanced usage like on a virtual server (VM). the default switch, as the name applies, is just a set up and forget virtual network adapter, made by Default, for Anyone without Any networking experience, to setup a quick VM using the quick VM creation in Hyper-V.

 

Any serious server admin knows Not to use the default switch for any server.

 

I don't know why some people fail to understand this.

 

Default switch changes IP address after every reboot because it is Smart, it evaluates the network environment and chooses a free and routable temporary IP address for the user to use it on their VM.

a user that doesn't need or doesn't know how to go through more advanced setups like External virtual network adapter.

 

 

 

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@HotCakeX 

 

So Microsoft provide a feature that they don't want you to use ? Why don't they just delete it or give option to delete it ?

 

It's not smart way to change IP after each reboot for routing, not at all , it is just a stupid bug may never be fixed.

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Who said they don't want you to use the default switch?
read my post again, it's for people who don't know much about networking so Hyper-V creates a pre-made virtual network adapter called default switch for them to help get internet connection on their VM.
people might be behind multiple NATs, different subnets and have multiple NICs, default switch is Smart so it identifies the difficulties of the network and creates a non-persistent route for the moment to give that user an Internet connection at any cost. the reason it chooses a non-persistent route is to Reevaluate the network environment for any changes. the random addresses gives it flexibility.

if the default switch is bugging you then you're doing it Wrong.
you're probably relying on an static IP address and instead of doing the proper and correct work of creating an external network adapter, you just used the default switch.
that's Not the right way.

this is something that I use for work and personal everyday and I've worked with lots of other professionals either IRL or collaborated over the Internet, Learned from them and experienced myself, nobody, I say again, Nobody chooses the default switch for a Virtual Server that needs a static IP address.
you can't do something wrong, get a bad result and then say it's a bug....

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Yeah, I'd be fine if I could just remove the default. It's a real headache when I need to connect my work laptop to the corporate network. I can't get on the corporate WLAN if there are any other unauthenticated adapter connections...and the vEthernet adapter is not authenticated. I know a registry hack to get around this issue...but the dang vEthernet adapter gets recreated on every boot and I have to re-apply the hack. I could write a script to do it, but its madness that I can't just get rid of the thing.
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@HotCakeX 
Please stop speaking for MS, it is stated nowhere that 
Microsoft never designed the default switch for long term usage or advanced usage like on a virtual server (VM)

The documentation said nothing about it. I've spent hours just to figure out that it's simply broken. 

Any serious server admin knows Not to use the default switch for any server.
It's not true again. You could use any default switch from every other software vendor except MS no matter are you serious or not. 
Why don't you just understand that it's not a feature, it's a bug, nobody doing this stuff except MS. Nobody period.  

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@sn00p 

 

 “Hyper-V has a Default Switch for easy networking.” Having just tried it out myself, I can affirm that this Default Switch makes Hyper-V networking dead simple.

 

https://searchenterprisedesktop.techtarget.com/blog/Windows-Enterprise-Desktop/Default-Switch-Makes-...

 

if you don't believe me, I can give you thousands of guides and YouTube videos to show everyone setting up a virtual servers uses External/Internal/Private network adapters, Not the default one.

 

 

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@mlmathews 


@mlmathews wrote:
Yeah, I'd be fine if I could just remove the default. It's a real headache when I need to connect my work laptop to the corporate network. I can't get on the corporate WLAN if there are any other unauthenticated adapter connections...and the vEthernet adapter is not authenticated. I know a registry hack to get around this issue...but the dang vEthernet adapter gets recreated on every boot and I have to re-apply the hack. I could write a script to do it, but its madness that I can't just get rid of the thing.

You can disable it from the network settings or device manager.

 

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@sn00p 

 

Previously you had to mess around using virtual switch manager to create a connection to network. Now you just select default switch if you like.

This option is essential for quick creating a new hyper-v session.

It is only used in existing sessions if you explicitly add it to a particular VM session.

Deleting it will not provide any additional security, or prevent other users creating a virtual switch.

Deleting things without understanding their functionality is surefire way to break things!

 

the 2nd comment

 

https://www.tenforums.com/virtualization/96064-hyper-v-cannot-delete-default-switch-after-fall-creat...

 

 

 

 

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True, but I have to re-disable it after every boot.
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@sn00p 

you said stop speaking for MS (Microsoft),

ok sure, of course, why not.

 

here is what Microsoft says, Not me:

 

Hyper-V has a Default Switch for easy networking

 

https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/Virtualization/What-s-new-in-Hyper-V-for-Windows-10-Fall-Crea...

 

Does a professional user who wants to setup a Virtual Server for serious work use something that is made for easy network? if he/she does then he/she is No longer called professional, but amateur. and for amateurs, Microsoft created the Default switch.

 

 

 

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@HotCakeX It's not a documentation. It's just a tech blogs with workarounds for an extremely buggy software. 
The default switch is not usable in almost every scenario except 2 minutes demo session and I bet it could fail even in this case. 
It's like a car moving randomly in every direction possible no matter the actual driver wants to drive.  


And the thing that you have to add more objects to make it works doesn't make it a feature, it's still a bug. And even more, it's completely undeletable. 
Please try Linux or simply VirtualBox so you could compare a MS mess and working solution from other vendors. Few hours for MS to make it work and few clicks on VB or few lines of configuration on Linux really makes a difference and MS is not a winner here. 

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The reality is something else, I'm sorry that you feel it's a bug but the fact is different. you're free to have your opinion.

Default switch is usable in Every scenario except those that require static IP addresses such as servers.

the majority of the computer users/home users in the world use dynamic IP address, ISPs all around the world give their subscribers dynamic IP addresses, they only lease static IP address only to those clients that pay more and explicitly ask for it.

there is no win or loss, it's not a race, the correct way is shown, now if someone decides to go the wrong way, then it's their fault.
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Well. HyperV doesn't have innate shared folders. Would you be so kind as to describe a procedure for sharing folders with Linux VM on the default switch?
It's not possible in the current implementation. There are hundreds of details you didn't take into account saying
"Default switch is usable in Every scenario except those that require static IP addresses such as servers".
It's not true, you can't even share folders. You can't use firewalls, you can't use ACLS or another wide used technics. It requires different third party software (all premium) and hours of configuring to be usable. Just compare it to simple two clicks in virtualbox before advocating weird and buggy MS implementation of the simplest thing ever widely available in every other similar software.
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It's also annoying that you have to switch your network from public to private every time the IP range changes for no reason.

A fixed range that changes only if there's a collision with the host's network would be enough. There is absolutely no need to randomize the IP range every time the host reboots.
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Not me.
you talked about another subject so I tried to stick to the topic and do not deviate. if you wanna talk about other subject you can open another topic.
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It's for easy networking and quick VM creation, anything in particular and more advanced feature you need you have to use other types of virtual network adapters.
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@HotCakeX How is it "advanced networking" if I just wanna attach a computer to a network, but need it to be designated a private network so the firewall just works.

 

At this point you're just defending your own point of view. You can't make a statement anymore where you don't feel personally attacked. It's become very tedious. Just let go.

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Nope,
attach your VM to the virtual network adapter, no problem, set the virtual network adapter Inside the VM to private, no problem, set the default network location for all known and unknown networks in Group Policy to private, no problem.


instead of talking about imaginary things about me, please stay on topic and Don't be rude.

so again,
1. use group policy, the local one, not the group policy management, to change network locations.
2. if you change the virtual network adapter INSIDE the VM, it WON'T change after reboot of the host.
computers on a network using DHCP do NOT change their network locations when the DHCP server gives them a different IP address.

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@HotCakeX

"set the default network location for all known and uknown networks in Group Policy to private, no problem"

 

What happened with your previous statement "It's for easy networking and quick VM creation"? Editing group policies is not quick and easy.

 

"computers on a network using DHCP do NOT change their network locations when the DHCP server gives them a different IP address."

 

They do when the new IP address is in a different subnet.

 

And stop assuming that your way of working with Hyper-V is the only truth.

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You don't wanna use other types of adapters so I said alright, if you want, here is the way.

if you use the group policy to change the network location for all known and unknown networks, meaning any future networks that appear will have the private location.

 

if you simply looked at my previous comments in the thread, you would know that it's not my way of thinking but many other people's. those links I mentioned are barely even 1%, there are lots of other proofs I can mention.

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Also there is another way,
none of these is for people looking for easy networking but if you insist on using something that is made by default for people with little to no networking experience, then here it goes:

write a script, save it as a .bat file and the script should take the network adapter name and set it as private, use the Windows task scheduler to make it run at every startup.
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I already have workarounds for that, np. The question was that the default switch for some reason is hardly usable in any scenario. It's not deletable, not configurable, not documented and changes it's own IP (as well as VM IP) address randomly. You can't use it outside of the very simple case - to have some simple internet inside VM for one session. In most scenarious it's just not enough no matter how skilled you are. Also it breaks other functionality like firewalls, access list, shared folders, streaming, NAT and all services inside VM which wants static address. And it means that any configuration is not reproducible and can't persist after a reboot. Every reboot you have to reconfigure VM services over and over. It's not the way software works in human world, it's just quirky MS implementation. And you have to pay for that's sad. I quit because it's not a discussion but more religious talk I guess.
DIXI
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Default switch is not to be used for advanced VMs where static IP address is required.

default switch was introduced only recently. what do you think people used to do All those Years then? default switch was added for one purpose and I mentioned what it is.
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@HotCakeX 

 

What will you say to yourself if MS fix this bug in future version ?

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I don't think it's a bug in the first place
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@HotCakeX 

 

Thank you for replying; I appreciate it.

 

I am using Windows 10 Version 1903, build 18362.329.

 

I'm in no way married to the Default Switch and am perfectly content to create another switch for my purposes. I simply need to meet the conditions described in my previous post.

 

The second configuration you suggest looks to be exactly what I want, and in fact, it's exactly what's described in the following blog post that @mlmathews cited earlier in the thread:

 

https://www.petri.com/using-nat-virtual-switch-hyper-v

 

 

This configuration does in fact function exactly the way I'd like, so I'm happy!

 

That said, I concur with @mlmathews that the Default Switch poses an annoyance now, for one specific reason: when I provision a virtual machine with Vagrant, I'm prompted which switch to use, because I now have more than one, whereas when only one switch exists, Vagrant chooses the only switch automatically and without prompting.

 

I've tried disabling the Default Switch in the Device Manager (which, of course, also causes it to be disabled in Control Panel\Network and Internet\Network Connections), but Vagrant still sees it as long as it's available in Hyper-V's Virtual Switch Manager.

 

In any case, I can live with this minor annoyance, as well as the fact that the Virtual Switch, despite it's un-intuitive behavior, may be working exactly as Microsoft intends. Whether or not that behavior is ill-conceived, short-sighted, and completely out of lockstep with that seen in competing products is another discussion in which I have far less interest than "just getting it working". ;)

 

And if the information offered in https://mikefrobbins.com/2018/11/08/managing-the-hyper-v-default-switch-in-windows-10-version-1709-a... has not changed substantially since its publication, removing the Default Switch sounds to be more trouble than it's worth.

 

Thanks again for all the help, everyone!

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Thank you very much, appreciate the kind words,
It's good to know that it's working out for you, unfortunately I don't much experience with Vagrant myself but I think this is a great feedback that you provided about Hyper-V and Vagrant incompatibility over the default switch, I think Microsoft can fix this with Vagrant just like they cooperate with VMWare to make compatible features, I would definitely up vote it if you post it in the uservoice or Feedback Hub.

Thanks again, have a good one!
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I realize that many of us have differing use-cases; some of us are software developers using Vagrant who want internal IP addresses, some of us are systems admins using Windows Server who want external IP addresses, and some of us are adamant about using the Default Switch whereas some of us don't care what switch we use as long as its IP address doesn't change.

 

For those who share my specific use-case (i.e., using Vagrant and impartial to the Default Switch), I wrote a comprehensive How-To, which you may find helpful:

 

https://superuser.com/a/1379582/176764

 

Hopefully, Vagrant and Microsoft can work together to eliminate all the hoop-jumping!

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I'm wondering, The default switch has only been with us for 2 years now, it's fairly new, so what were the Vagrant users using before Default switch was even introduced?
Hyper-V itself is not new and people have been using it for Years, when it didn't have Default switch, but suddenly 2 years ago Microsoft introduced it for users with no networking experience and then all the professionals decides to use it too.

so yeah I'm wondering why not do the same thing that they were before Default switch was even in Hyper-V.
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In my case, the only reason I'm trying to use Hyper-V now is that it's required if you want to user Windows containers / Docker Desktop on Windows 10. I'd much prefer to still be using VMware Workstation, but unfortunately VMware and Hyper-V can't co-exist (yet). So I've bitten bullet and moved to Hyper-V. I'm honestly really surprised how far behind Hyper-V is in capabilities and flexibility compared to VMware Workstation given how long Hyper-V has been around.
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Could you name some of those missing capabilities that you're talking about?
for me the Only capabilities that Hyper-V is missing is tabbed VM session viewing, when working with multiple VMs at the same time. but that's the nature of it because of RDP and there are programs that have tabbed RDP session feature.
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@HotCakeX 

 

I don't have time to list everything I've noticed, but I'll give you a couple of networking examples.

 

In VMware both the NAT and host-only networks have a virtual DHCP server that's configurable.

 

Another example is in VMware a bridged virtual adapter can be set to automatically select a physical adapter to bridge...so if you are developing on a laptop it will automatically switch between wifi and ethernet.

 

 

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@Bala Sundaram put the following in a PowerShell script and add to task scheduler, then run at logon. Change the #staticIP to desired IP.

 

An alternative is to put the script in local group policy using a .bat file to kick it off. 

"powershell.exe -ExecutionPolicy Bypass -File "script.ps1""

 

 

#Sets a static IP on the HyperV default switch (Windows 10).
Set-ExecutionPolicy Bypass -Scope Process -Force

#wait for network to come up
while (-Not (Test-Connection -ComputerName 1.0.0.1 -Quiet))
{}

$staticIP = "172.18.79.1"
$hyperVnet = Get-NetIPAddress -InterfaceAlias "vEthernet (Default Switch)" | select InterfaceAlias,InterfaceIndex,AddressFamily,IPAddress,PrefixLength | where {$_.AddressFamily -match "IPv4"}

#Remove old IP address, otherwise there will be two IP addresses
Remove-NetIPAddress -IPAddress $hyperVnet.IPAddress -Confirm:$false

New-NetIPAddress -InterfaceIndex $hyperVnet.InterfaceIndex -IPAddress $staticIP -PrefixLength $hyperVnet.PrefixLength

 

 

 

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@mlmathews The problem is not being able to destroy the old switch. How did you manage that?

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@GlaucomaPredator  I have not found a way to permanently delete the Default Switch. I've been just ignoring it for now.

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Guy, kudos for dragging this conversation for so long... And I see each has their own set of arguments.

 

But what @HotCakeX keeps forgetting is to tell the whole truth about his setup, and whole truth (and main issues) with DefaultSwitch.

 

Yes, DefaultSwitch is all fine for my granny to put a VM on her Win10 and put it online. But what is not ok is:

- that DefaultSwitch permanently grabs one ethernet connection for it's own purposes

- this connection may well be only one, for example, on workstation PC which isn't on WiFi, and doesn't have 2 LAN adapters

- cannot be removed

- prevents you from setting up second virtual switch / adapter on same interface as it is already binded to DefaultSwitch

- no workaround as DefaultSwitch keeps recreating itself on each reboot (so if you remove it, it will be there next reboot, if you disable it, it will be re-enabled, etc)

 

All is good, I have several clusters I can use to put VMs on them, with all dedicated connections, and all. But sometimes I just want/need to use a small VM on my PC, and I want it to KEEP the IP addresses same through reboots. There is simply NO REASON for it to be recreated every time, my local networks don't change, if 172.18.123.15 isn't conflicting on one reboot, it's not gonna conflict on next reboot. Yet - Win10 will still recreate it if I reboot, and with new IP range. There is also NO REASON for DefaultSwitch to be unremovable. We had Hyper-V before Default Switch, and on client PCs, and it worked just fine. Sure, make DefaultSwitch default config, my grandma really likes showing CentOS on her VMs from time to time, but give the option for REAL USERS (aka developers, sysadmins, etc) to remove/disable the DefaultSwitch garbage and use Hyper-V same way we've used it for years on our PCs. Instead, we have to keep Googling and hoping something will change with time. Or just endure the bad state of things, and use "real servers" just so we can have a small VM for whatever purposes we need it.

 

Btw, those that want to evaluate software sometimes want to make a small proof of concept on their workstation, without it requiring 2 more teams to allow you to a) put these VMs on their clusters b) create temporary networks for you to test something for a week or two.

 

Let me go back to the main thing that hurts a lot of people... @HotCakeX you said you have your whole setup with home router and cheap 20$ WiFi adapter... yet you are forgetting to tell people that you also have second built-in adapter that you have in same PC/laptop. One that DefaultSwitch grabbed and "polluted" forever, and then you are using a 20$ adapter as your external adapter. That's paying 20$ for Microsoft's decision to make DefaultSwitch UNREMOVABLE.

 

Anyway, thanks for again confirming that MS still didn't fix this properly (and will probably stay broken as is), I'll revisit this in a year or so again, just to check if I can finally get back to the functionality I had with Windows 7, without buying new adapters, setting up new test WiFi environments, laying down new cables or buying new switches, just so my workstation could have a VM with ... predictable IP.

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Don't worry, I didn't forget anything.

I have 1 active network adapter and I connect that 1 network adapter to an external virtual network adapter and use it on my VM. no other adapter has connection. default switch never shows any error or prevent from creating an external network adapter and connect it to your only physical network adapter that has Internet.

if you don't want your IP to be reset every time, use the External virtual network adapter.